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Post by 1ppnotforme on Jun 11, 2013 14:18:09 GMT -5
Finally some posts I can agree with. The PBA needs to get behind Suozzi 1000% NOW. Be proactive and act now. Who cares what Tom may have said in the past. As I said earlier, we would not be in this situation if Tom had won last time. If we do a "no endorsement" like last time, we will not be playing ball with whoever wins, like last time, and we will be screwed again. Tom in, Ed out.
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Post by guest333000 on Jun 11, 2013 15:26:40 GMT -5
My guess is that the county won't win the appeal. There is more money involved than just what Nassau owes. Should Wexler have to rule on the other issues particularly the issue of constitutional violation. That ruling would apply to every control board established state wide and would invalidate wage freezes in those counties as well. It is easy to conclude that the hope is that Nassau unions win on this issue and does not push on a ruling on the constitutionality of being able to impose such a wage freeze.
This where unions should still push for a ruling. In the future what will stop politicians from instituting more financial control boards with the power to impose wage freezes? All union heads are at fault for not being proactive on NIFA. In 2001 we all knew that they had the power impose a freeze. Everyone was ready to stop the Mangano law as soon as it was made into law. Why not NIFA? The law was unconstitutional then also. If the lawsuit was put in 2001 we wouldn't have even seen the freeze.
If unions win, the state will have to borrow to help Nassau out again. The state will amend the NIFA act to extend the boards powers to guarantee this new loan. Yay more freezes unless there is judge that will find freezes unconstitutional.
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regrets
Participating Member
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Post by regrets on Jun 11, 2013 17:19:47 GMT -5
I would agree that of course we need to back Suozzi. If he would have taken race seriously last time, we would not be in this mess. It does suck that in his plan to get the county back on track, he has said repeatedly that he needs to have NIFA here for 4 years after he wins. Personally I do not think he will win.
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Post by googleyes on Jun 11, 2013 17:47:11 GMT -5
The issue isn't that NIFA never had the power to freeze wages in an economic crisis, its that their authority to impose a wage freeze expired two years before they froze us. That is what the ruling is on. It's just a technicality but hey f'em. Most cases are won or lost on technicalities. I don't think the case is even going to address the issue of them violating our constitutional rights by freezing our contract. It's my understanding that NIFA's authority to freeze wages had expired and that's what the judge ruled on. I don't think it got far enough to touch on constitutional rights. I could be wrong but that's how I understood Judge Wexlers decision even though he did make statements about them violating our contract his actual ruling was on that expiration technicality.
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Post by guest333000 on Jun 11, 2013 19:26:31 GMT -5
From the web.
No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; pass any Bill of Attainder, ex post facto Law, or Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts, or grant any Title of Nobility. The Contract Clause prohibits states from enacting any law that retroactively impairs contract rights. The Contract Clause applies only to state legislation, not court decisions.
The Framers of the Constitution added this clause in response to the fear that states would continue a practice that had been widespread under the Articles of Confederation—that of granting "private relief." Legislatures would pass bills relieving particular persons (predictably, influential persons) of their obligation to pay their debts. It was this phenomenon that also prompted the framers to make bankruptcy law the province of the federal government.
"Law impairing the Obligation of Contracts".
Government can pass any law they wish. It not until it is fought in court is a law deemed illegal. Such as the Mangano law.
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zzzz
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Post by zzzz on Jun 11, 2013 20:06:10 GMT -5
All that stuff is good reading and sounds great about protecting the people vs govt imposing things on people. However in the America we live in these days it is more about( acting) like they're for the people but in fact it is for total Govt control. The courts are making judgements not on the actual facts but what's in the best interest of govt when deciding
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Post by opie on Jun 11, 2013 21:46:33 GMT -5
Exactly since when does our government follow the constitution anymore?
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Post by 1090cop on Jun 11, 2013 22:21:19 GMT -5
Contribute to the suozzi campaign its our only hope.
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ncpd17
Participating Member
Living the Dream!
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Post by ncpd17 on Jun 16, 2013 9:40:49 GMT -5
zzzz ....to reply to your post earlier in this thread. Our current situation has EVERYthing to do with JIMMY and our board. This situation is uncomfortable for all of us, but we have done close to ZERO to make ED Mangano uncomfortable. We should have members at EVERY SINGLE event that ED holds. Holding up signs, reminding the public of the shady contractor deals and patronage positions going on in the county; reminding taxpayers of all the higher fees they are paying for everything, and all the social services that have been cut. In NYC when there were contract disputes (no where near being frozen) PD guys followed Bloomberg, and before him Giuliani around all day to make them uncomfortable. We have done NOTHING... Wait - we have held ONE rally.... ONE, and we were bunched in with the CSEA workers !!!!! JIMMY and the board are relying on this lawsuit, but doing nothing to help any other avenues along. What is the back-up plan? This board has no balls, cant think ahead, and has done NOTHING to help the membership since Jimmy was elected. Also, this is what happens when you don't back a candidate for county exec. Look at Suffolk - their PBA backed Bellone, and even though Suffolk is in bad financial shape Suffolk was given a decent contract and they got the LIE back. Learn how to play ball, grow a set and back your man and you are rewarded. Regardless of how this lawsuit plays out - we should ALL look forward for the upcoming FALL elections and start planning NOW. - #1 - Vote out ED, #2 - Vote out Jimmy. I have to say I LIKE THIS IDEA! We all know the politicians are kissing up to the fire service to try and get their votes. I don't think it's a bad idea to start pointing out their lies and screw-ups, and what better place to do it then at their public displays of affection! I will say it should be the PBA/COBA/CSEA union folks as they are the only ones that can't be messed with. This is something that has dramatically affected every county worker.
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Post by 1090cop on Jun 17, 2013 20:02:26 GMT -5
zzzz ....to reply to your post earlier in this thread. Our current situation has EVERYthing to do with JIMMY and our board. This situation is uncomfortable for all of us, but we have done close to ZERO to make ED Mangano uncomfortable. We should have members at EVERY SINGLE event that ED holds. Holding up signs, reminding the public of the shady contractor deals and patronage positions going on in the county; reminding taxpayers of all the higher fees they are paying for everything, and all the social services that have been cut. In NYC when there were contract disputes (no where near being frozen) PD guys followed Bloomberg, and before him Giuliani around all day to make them uncomfortable. We have done NOTHING... Wait - we have held ONE rally.... ONE, and we were bunched in with the CSEA workers !!!!! JIMMY and the board are relying on this lawsuit, but doing nothing to help any other avenues along. What is the back-up plan? This board has no balls, cant think ahead, and has done NOTHING to help the membership since Jimmy was elected. Also, this is what happens when you don't back a candidate for county exec. Look at Suffolk - their PBA backed Bellone, and even though Suffolk is in bad financial shape Suffolk was given a decent contract and they got the LIE back. Learn how to play ball, grow a set and back your man and you are rewarded. Regardless of how this lawsuit plays out - we should ALL look forward for the upcoming FALL elections and start planning NOW. - #1 - Vote out ED, #2 - Vote out Jimmy. Exactly, Jimmy has been nonexistent in opposing Mangano on his 100s of fvck ups. Vote out Mangano then put someone up for PBA president that has some balls!
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zzzz
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Post by zzzz on Jun 17, 2013 22:09:25 GMT -5
Guys i gotta tell you.... Jimmy and the PBA board is not the reason we are frozen. Its been said before but it is the truth. Ive been skeptical in the past also about what they are actually doing for us however in this matter theres really not much more they can do. The decision is in the hands of judges at this point. Lets see what happens. Also as you read in Newsrag there are other matters at hand Jimmy has to focus on also. Another battle to fight is our rights in disciplinary hearings. Thats a huge issue guys. If you get jammed up ( sometimes out of your control) the PBA has to see that there is a fair process to protect us. What my point is here is lets not focus on pointing fingers just yet. The PBA has to be steady and not fly off the handle at every little setback. If they do that we will all look like a laughing stock group both to the public and to the politicians that actually lobby for us. There will be a time soon to go public about an endorsement and in my opinion it should be immediately after the judges decision is rendered. Hopefully they'll go for Tom Suozzi
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